Those of you who have been on the GEBB for some time know that I do have issues with our current pension system. However, Quinn's suggested changes will be devastating to teachers statewide. I urge you to consider the points listed below....keeping in mind we do not receive social security benefits and we do pay into the system fairly substantially.

In brief, Quinn's proposals include:

(1) Raising teacher's pension contribution an additional two percent of the salary. This would make our contribution rate one of the highest in the nation and amount to a considerable salary reduction.

(2) Impose a huge health care premium increase for state and university employees in the Quality Care Health Plan (PPO). Starting July 1st, this would amount to a 245% increase in premiums for retirees. Current and future state and university employees would see an increase at retirement of 4,300% (that's right) in your average medical premium.

(3) Skip $3 billion dollars in owed state pension payments this year and next year. This would worsen the already huge pension debt which stands at over $73 billion currently and put the very future of our pension system at risk. He calls this a "pension holiday".

(4) Slash pension benefits for all new hired teachers and state employees. In addition this would cut the pension multiplier back to 2% for teachers (from the 2.2 many of you just repaid), raise the retirement age to 67, cut the maximum benefit accrual and change the salary basis for your pension to the average of the final 8 years of service instead of the last 4 best years.

Everyone is taking a hit.....everyone. That includes teachers and admin and unfortunately counselors. Why should this be any different than what everybody else has had to face.

Won't they just try to negotiate it back in their next contract?

The pension system is not a contract negotiated item. It's a state retirement system. I don't think there are many teachers who would disagree that we need to make some adjustments or "take a hit" as you suggest, Rob. But the idea that the state keeps taking money from the pension system that was put there directly from our paychecks is just wrong. Also, taking a "hit" to the tune of having a 4,300% increase in the average medical premium is more than a hit!

Jombl, I didn't take the day off of work and would never do that...there are many other times we educators can lobby for ourselves without missing work. And I don't totally agree with the teacher's letter - though I agree with a lot of it.

This is obviously a big topic of discussion in the faculty cafe (for the 25 minutes I take to eat most days). The consensus among the vast majority of my peers is that some concessions should be made but Quinn's plan would be devastating. I'm all for a lower payout - instead of the 70-75%, I think more along the lines of 60%. And I'd actually support paying in a slightly higher percentage too. I'm for more moderate solution and the state legislature leaving the money that is there alone.

Why shouldn't teachers and retirees feel the pinch everyone else is feeling? The union has done very well for the teachers for years and years. Maybe it is about time there is a "correction" and there is no time like the present.

Amy: What is the amount that is being raised 4300%?

This is sort of like me saying lawyers are not paid enough for real estate transactions. Although it's true, nobody cares about us, and at this point in the economy, nobody thinks teachers are underpaid.

I didn't ask anyone to line up and fight the union battle by any means and I think if you read my post, you should see that I agree with paying more in and getting less out. I also said that most of the people I work with agree that we need to find a workable solution. So, your fight is not with me or with most of my co-workers!

My only point what that Quinn's plan is too extreme.

BTW, I set aside money in a 403(b) because I'm not confident that I will ever see all the thousand of dollars I've put in.

1) Your contribution rate would go from 7% to 9%. I think most people put in 10-12% of their salaries into 401K's. Tack onto that the 7.65 for SS and 1.25 for Medicare and again you still seem like you're coming out ahead.

So you're paying nine percent does not sound to drastic. Again your pension would be guaranteed.


2) There is an old saying figures don't lie but liars figure. So when you're talking about a 245% increase and a 4300% increase it would be good to know what you're talking about in raw numbers. Say a retiree is paying 10 dollars per month a 245% increase is roughly 25 dollars. A 4300 increase would see it go up to 430.00 a month.

But that 430.00 A month is what many civilians pay out of pocket already.

3). Not sure if this is such a good idea. Sounds like another shell game. They must be hoping the market returns to make some of that.

4). All I can say is welcome to the real world. corporate America has been slashing pension benefits for years. Many companies have a two tier system. One for new employees, one for employees who have been grandfathered into the system.

One of the reasons GM, Chrysler are now surviving on government handouts is the generous pension and health care agreements they made years ago.

The State of Illinois is now 13B in debt. We are going to be told that our income taxes are going up by 50% next year.

The primary reason is the pension and health care benefits that are given to Teachers and State employees. You cannot ask Taxpayers to continuously pay more and more taxes for benefits they do not have.


Teacher and State employee pay is now comparable if not better than counterparts in the civilian work force. So the pension and other benefits are now gravy on top of that.

Sorry, Amy welcome to our world.

If any of our kids acted like these so called educators did for Governor Quinn . They would be getting suspended for a week and having their parents come in.

Something doesn’t add up here. Judging from board comments teaching must be the cushiest job in the world. But then why are there teacher shortages? I’ve sometimes contemplated teaching science and math as a semi retirement job as most states are absolutely begging for such teachers. Many will pay 100% of your Masters and insure you get through in 3 semesters plus student teaching if you will just please, please, please, please teach science and math. Other states are losing more teachers to retirement than they can replace with qualified newcomers resulting in a lessening of qualifications just to fill positions. Hmmmmm.

Dont think there is a teaching shortage. Most school districts have an abundance of applicants for available jobs.

Illinois produces more teachers than open teaching positions. There might be a few states that have some shortages in specific areas.

But overall there is not a teaching shortage.
Illinois last year saw a decrease of roughly 2500 students. In public schools this trend will probably continue.

The current economic depression has cut back on retirements among teachers so this great hype about so many hundreds of thousand of teachers retiring is probably over blown.

So, what states are willing to pay for your Masters . Do you have a list

Illinois does not have a teacher shortage, in fact it appears that we have a teacher glut. Didn't the Trib do a story about 2 months ago about just this subject? I recall them detailing that our state produces something like 5,000 new teachers a year for less than 1,000 openings. I personally know at least 10 Glen Ellynites who went back to school for teaching certificates over the last 5 year period and only 1 of them got a job.

I'm the last person to bash teachers. It is one of the hardest jobs going and one that you really need to be passionate about to do a good job. The hours are much longer than advertised school hours and most pour their hearts and souls into their jobs. My kids have had some really great teachers over the years and only a few who were clearly drawn to it for the benefits - they don't seem inspired, they are the first ones out the door at the end of the day and they've been teaching the same plans over and over. That said, enough is enough. This state is being sucked dry and Quinn's attempts to turn off the faucet that is gushing money for pensions is long overdue. Sure, it sucks to have something you've been counting on reduced, but it's time for school employees to experience what their students' families have been feeling. I'll bet there are plenty of new grads and career changers who would gladly take over the teaching jobs of the expensive old guard for less pay and benefits. I say let the market dictate.

Is anybody else close to retching when you hear the "heart wrenching" NEA ads on the radio imploring Gov. Quinn to reconsider his budget?

A quick internet search shows a 200,000 shortage of science and math teachers in the next decade. Illinois pays for a Masters.
And no, I don't think jumping out of the job at retirement age has much to do with it. Many private employers do the same to replace highly paid employees with cheaper newbies. However, there is a huge differential in pay between suburban and rural communities. You get what you pay for. I was always impressed by the majority of the Glenbard School District teachers when I had school age children and felt my children got a superior public education to whats commonly available in the US.

I actually have a lot of sympathy for the teachers. Granted, they make obscene amounts of money over the long term but a good chunk of it is tied up in pension benefits that are subject to government whims. They get everything they want, but they are always on the verge of losing it. That's why they need the government to fund the pensions so badly. They want to lock away the cash because know the state's promises are worth even less than fed's promises to provide social security. And sure, gov't pensions have constitutional protection in Illinois, but the gay marriage issue has shown how easy it can be to amend a constitution if you have the support of the people. And the longer the underfunding goes on, and the more the teachers abuse the system, the less support they're going to have when the pension tsunami crests in a few years and washes away all their entitlements. Free money is nice, but if you come to rely on it . . . that's a sword of Damocles hanging over your head.

quote:

Originally posted by GE Fan:
Illinois is one of them.

Taxpayer - it feels so good to be on the same side as you. Let's not discuss the hot dog man ever again. Deal?

Deal.

A more researched internet search revelaed this.
Teaching Shortage Myth

Bio, if you're intersted, you don't have to spend 3 semesters to get into teaching. There are alternative certification programs. See Benedictine's website for an example. This is an intensive summer program followed by a school-year long paid internship. This is for high school/middle school, though, not elementary.

quote:

But the idea that the state keeps taking money from the pension system that was put there directly from our paychecks is just wrong.

If this is true, it is indeed wrong. Are you sure that this is what it going on?

It is my understanding that the 7% withheld from a union eductor's salary [with a 7% match by the district - funded via property tax levy. See: Current DuPage County tax bills "Pension Fund D87" line item] in Illinois goes directly into the TRS.

The State of Illinois is on the hook to fund the OTHER 86% of TRS [and SURS, SRS and other legacy defined-benefit monstrosities] out of General Revenue.

Ill-Annoy has been shorting this portion of the pension slush fund for YEARS. I need clarification on exactly WHICH monies are the subject of this so-called "pension holiday".

Is it the contributory and matched payroll deductions?

Or is it other funds that the state is [ostensibly] legally obligated to pour in from income tax, Lotto and all other revenue sources?

If it is the latter, all I can say is: It's about time.

2009-10 shortages by state

80 pages of shortages by field in what looks to be every state.

Thanks Mid for the info. I am considering high school science and math but Ive got a few years before the last kids out of college. I'd probably teach in a rural area actually- it's more that I like the educational field and will need health benefits than I care about pay. That said, I still say we have great schools here and of course that comes at a price.

quote:

So if I understand you correctly BTN

I think you do but I have asked for clarification.

I read about some "radical taxpayers" who were considering filing a lawsuit against a north suburban high school district. These "radicals" weren't residents of said district that they were considering suing.

Not being a barrister, I have no idea if such a suit has grounds but the basis of their planned lawsuit seemed to be:

After bumping the Superintendent's salary to some OBSCENE level over his final three years [to something like $325,000 per year], and thereby entitling him to an equally OBSCENE annual Illinois TRS pension benefit [something like $215,000 per year], since 86% of his $215K per year payout would be paid by OTHER taxpayers in Illinois [including them], they thought they'd give it a shot.

Even though they weren't taxpayers in the district that had so egregiously jacked this guy's salary up.

All I remember [too lazy to look it up] was that this guy? The $215K per year [age 56 or so] retiree went right out to Arizona and got another Super gig for a measly $195,000 per year.

How can a guy live on $410,000 per year these days?

The best place to find out what jobs are open is by the county Regional Offices of Education, Jombl. I'd say we do have a difficult time finding math and science teachers. There are applicants but not the quality or depth in other areas such as English or Social Studies. Those areas are flooded.

I'm not going to argue against people's frustrations because that's a losing battle. I'm also not clueless about the cost of healthcare (and my district doesn't pick up anywhere near as much of the cost of health care as they do here in GE) so please don't try to imply that because I'm an educator, I don't understand the real world...trust me, I do. And so do many other educators.

Obviously it would be stupid of us to just turn the other way and not try to protect our pensions.

I agree - you have to try. And despite the statistics on teaching certificates, most good schools (read "suburban," here...) get the good teachers. I'm sure if you looked up the job listings for rural Illinois, you'd find more openings. And a teaching certificate from Podunk College, while adding to the numbers, isn't necessarily as valuable as one from a better university.

I'm sure that the number of Law School Students is greater than the number of job openings in the legal profession...

Unfortunately, I find myself in the position of GE Fan in re: the Hot Dog Man - I can see both sides of this...

Best of luck to you, though...

William