And Bitter, please, you are sooooo not a Pastor. It's not your job. It IS Lillian's job and she does takes it just as seriously as anyone who has a mission and goals, as we often do in any position we may hold..
Here is where I miss your point GE. although I agree (and I do not think the two parties are that far apart here) with most of your points, Bitter's interpretation of meaning of the scripture and/or sermon is equally as valid as Dr.Daniels'. Do you need to sit in a church every Sunday to achieve Christianity? Does the fact that you hear a sermon make the position right? Because it comes from a clergy source? This argument is wide open to interpretation, and better left for heartier souls in another thread. Please, let's not make this discussion as to whose traditional Christian values are better than others. You have missed this point.
Who the hell are all these guys, BB? Do they work for the village or PADS? I may have met one of them that one time you made that BBQ at the one guys house...with the drunk bartender. That was awesome!
Originally posted by Russ: This relationship is like that of the kids that hang out in front of my house before and after visiting the playground near my house.
Are you seriously comparing the children who live in our community with the adults who travel from PADS site to PADS site (many of whom take the train in from the city) for a free meal and bed?
Out of curiosity... do you people in the church ask these people who is paying their cell phone bills? I'm always curious. I understand you don't want them smoking and making phone calls inside the church, but why do you force them outside and onto the sidewalks to make their calls and chain smoke?
Russ... this is where you and Lillian say "But, your children smoke and talk on the phone too!"
People, you're doing it again, and it's getting really annoying. Choose your words more carefully. As I noted a week or two ago...
Not all homeless people are PADS clients, and not all homeless people are vagrants. Being homeless -- or being a PADS client -- is not a crime, nor is it a police matter.
Conversely, not all vagrants are PADS clients, and not all PADS clients are vagrants. For that matter, not all vagrants are homeless. Vagrancy is a crime, and is a police issue.
As words, "homeless," "vagrants" and "PADS clients" are not interchangeable. The distinctions between the three is very important, especially from a problem-solving point-of-view.
Please use the correct word or phrase when discussing the particular group you wish to support or fight... otherwise your arguments are indefensible and, frankly, often make little sense. --TedE
Posts: 1372 | Location: Glen Ellyn, IL USA | Registered: March 21, 2003
I want to be open minded about this, so if anyone who has worked with PADS can clarify the following questions, please do.
What is the PADS business plan and what metrics are kept to ensure they get continued funding from government agencies?
What job training programs are available through PADS?
What drug treatment programs are available through PADS?
What couseling programs are available through PADS?
How does PADS know when it's program of "hots & cots" has been "successful" with one of it's guests? What is the definition of success? How does PADS capture this metric?
"The most valuable things in life are not measured in monetary terms. The really important things are not houses and lands, stocks and bonds, automobiles and real state, but friendships, trust, confidence, empathy, mercy, love and faith. " -Bertrand Russell V. Delong
Posts: 3305 | Location: Glen Ellyn, IL | Registered: April 04, 2003
Amy-This is good stuff, but I'm still wondering how they measure success and evaluate their guests?
When I worked in the theraputic community, the patient's observed behavior was documented ("chart") at least once a shift, if not more. Reactions to therapy and medications were all documented for legal & theraputic reasons. There were weekly consultations with the attending psychiatrist and staff to determine how (or even if) the patient was progressing. Even with the close, hourly obeservation, it would be difficult to gage the patients ability to re-enter society. Many figured out what the staff wanted to hear and manipulated the system to their advantage. I personally encoutered patients who became violent just before discharge, they became a harm to themselves or others, so they could remain in a safe, secure enviorment-the hospital. It was frustrating for me to put so much time, effort and emotion into helping a person, just to see them sabotage the millieu. Unfortunately, I could not accept this cycle as a solution and left the profession.
It's a tough nut to crack and I don't have the answer. Problem is, I'm not sure for the mentally ill, that PADS does either. For the transient person who has hit a rough patch in life, PADS is a great tool. For the mentally ill, I see it as a poor stop gap that has the potential to endanger PADS volunteers, other guests and the surrounding community.
It's actually not a tough nut to crack at all- Here is our State -- nami.org... You get what you pay for.
And of course PADS is a stop gap. I'm sure PADS would agree that much, much more help by way of programs ($) are needed besides simple shelter and food. Obviously Illinois is unwilling to address the problem. Unfortunately I expect the problem will worsen quite a bit in the coming months.
And I think history shows that the true dangers to society can usually be found living among us- not in a homeless shelter (e.g. JW Gacy)
This message has been edited. Last edited by: Ted E.,
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored. Aldous Huxley
Posts: 20 | Location: South of FDR | Registered: January 17, 2005
I still agree re: the need for more care for mental illness. The problem is, there just isn't enough and PADS is doing, IMO, the best it can within the framework of what few resources there are. I repeatedly posed the question, What should we do with those who are mentally ill when there are little-to-no resources??
Yoss, I'm sure if you contacted PADS to ask about their reporting and measures, I'd think you could get their annual report or something like it.
"The most valuable things in life are not measured in monetary terms. The really important things are not houses and lands, stocks and bonds, automobiles and real state, but friendships, trust, confidence, empathy, mercy, love and faith. " -Bertrand Russell V. Delong
Posts: 3305 | Location: Glen Ellyn, IL | Registered: April 04, 2003
Amy, I'm glad you are "back". We here, on a small town BB are not going to solve the problems of the world but it does allow some venting needed due to great frustration. I too, want to help those down on their luck but Pads is not the place for the mentally ill. I worked for years for a nonprofit and when we were trying to find shelter for a needy pregnant woman, Pads was never an acceptable safe choice. I just wish "WE" could really do something positive with all this frustration/energy. Pads has changed the community and I'm afraid, not for the better. As a high taxpaying member of this county, I would agree to pay for a Pads center (like we pay for COD) away from the CBD where our town's economy would not be effected and if that is too NIMBYish, oh well.
I'm concerned that the mentally ill will slip through the cracks because PADS or any other shelter are not equiped to assess them.
When an organization is funded based on head count, where is the incentive to reduce headcount?
It is sad that in this country we can quickly get $ 700 billion to bail out Wall St., but funding for schools, helping the mentally ill and job training is a glacial process.
Governor Blagojevich announced that 450 state workers will be laid off as a result of the $1.4 billion in cuts he made to the fiscal year 2009 budget.
Four departments will be hit with the lay offs, including 300 positions at the Department of Children and Family Services, 75 at the Department of Human Services, and another 75 from the Department of Natural Resources and the Historic Preservation Agency.
According to the State Journal Register (SJ-R), the lay offs will be effective December 1st.
375 0f the 450 are social services. I don't think this bodes well for local initiatives such as PADS. It appears that this will be all we have left to help those in need as the Feds and the State cut services to those in need.
What a shame.
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored. Aldous Huxley
Posts: 20 | Location: South of FDR | Registered: January 17, 2005
