quote:

Originally posted by bitterboy:
When was the last time someone attended a village board meeting and drilled them about this persistent problem. This is why I am trying to organize, it's the only way. Strength is in the numbers on this one.

If the Village were smart , it would quietly take care of this problem, as no doubt the other nearby suburbs do, rather than enduring the eventual negative publicity this will obviously invite, i.e., the mean-spirited, greedy populace of GE vs. the poor innocent homeless population. The natives are getting restless.

quote:

Originally posted by Fish:
You may not like these individuals that are so eloquently nick-named, but from what I am reading, the disdain seems to originate more from their mere existence in our presence than any "crime" they may be committing by asking for money or similar offenses. I dislike being asked for money from them exactly as much as I dislike being asked to buy peanuts from the Kiwanis at every other stop light. Despite my stinginess, the Kiwanis and our homeless persist in asking. Maybe they persist because it is profitable. (I've witnessed the exchange of "bills" (yes plural, but not sure of denomination) between a resident and a homeless person outside of Starbucks). I'm not saying that if the GE well ran dry for them that they would disappear, but I think it would help. Now, about those Kiwanis......

It really is one's prerogative to give money to whomever they wish, and I certainly don't fault those that wish to give their money to someone that they feel is deserving. My angle on this situation could very well apply to just about anyone, not necessarily the homeless. I do not dislike the homeless because they clutter our streets and make me feel guilty. They certainly do not do the latter. I dislike anyone that breaks the rules and laws of society that I myself would not be allowed to get away with. I am thoroughly disgusted by drunk/stoned gentlemen passed out on public benches. I am drunk with anger when I see vagrancy and panhandling. I am pissed beyond belief when I see a group of gentlemen, stripped down to their pants in a public park, drinking alcohol (again, could have been Perrier...I understand this) out of bottles wrapped in brown paper bags. Why does this anger me? Again, because I would not be allowed to do these things. I know I would not be allowed to do these things. Society and the law would not allow me to do these things. Yet there appears to be a subset of our population that is getting a pass with regard to the afforementioned behavior. Is it because they are homeless? I have no clue. Would I be equally as p1ssed if it were one of us exhibiting this behavior on the streets of our town? Hell yes.

Help the homeless all you like. And I say this to PADS and any other organization that feels they are helping those that are apparently in need. If you come into my home or my town, you damn well better treat it with the respect that you want to be treated yourself. Don't go p1ssing in our parks, don't go drinking on our streets, don't accost our citizens. You want to be a guest, be a good guest or stay the **** outta Dodge.

Well said Clam. Though I have less of an issue with folks hanging out in downtown GE...as long as they aren't soliciting for money or intimidating people.

The Kiwanis, Lion's Club, etc. have permits, do they not? Besides, if I give money to them, I know how they use it. If I give money to a homeless guy, he'll be back for more and usually spends it on smokes or alcohol - something that can't possibly help their situation. That's why I give money to PADS and volunteer my time to help the homeless because I know how those resources will be used.

This still does not solve the issue of having virtually no mental health care.....

Fish, I get your point and I don't like being asked for $ either. However, I don't think it's fair to compare Kiwanis Peanut Day to panhandling by our homeless for the fact that Kiwanis is a licensed organization. There is no violation of the law. They secure permits for the days they are out. If you have reason to believe that they do not have permission to be out asking for money then I agree with you and its a problem too.

quote:

Originally posted by Amy:
Well said Clam. Though I have less of an issue with folks hanging out in downtown GE...as long as they aren't soliciting for money or intimidating people.

The Kiwanis, Lion's Club, etc. have permits, do they not? Besides, if I give money to them, I know how they use it. If I give money to a homeless guy, he'll be back for more and usually spends it on smokes or alcohol - something that can't possibly help their situation. That's why I give money to PADS and volunteer my time to help the homeless because I know how those resources will be used.

This still does not solve the issue of having virtually no mental health care.....

I have no problem with people being on our streets, in our parks or utilizing the stores and restaurants in our town. If my rant came off sounding that way, I apologize. People have the right to be in and about public property as long as they are following the rules and laws of society. What arrogance we would be exhibiting if we didn't want someone to peacefully and privately enjoy a cup of coffee simply for what they looked like or what their station in life is. I'm certain many of you have seen me on any given weekend day...and I do not look very presentable.

Ok, so what do you do with the person who is picking through the trash outside of Thipi Thai while customers are seated in the window eating their $20 plate? What do you do with the person who is hacking up phlegm balls and discarding cig butts under their table, while customers are seated trying to enjoy their morning breakfast? What do you do with a person who is filthy dirty and just downright smells offensive? These, as far as I know are not violations of our village ordinances, but does harm its economic development in a big way. I agree in that we shouldn't discriminate against a person based on their looks or social status. However, as unfortunate as it is, out of towners who come here to shop are not going to be as forgiving. I am not trying to be an *** here, but how do we handle this?

quote:

Originally posted by Clamato:
I'm certain many of you have seen me on any given weekend day...and I do not look very presentable.

Don't think I've seen you...but I'm sure when I do I'll recognize you by your comically large cabeza.

quote:

Originally posted by middlein87:
And wasn't PADS going to get bikes for our guests? I would think that would encourage them to get OUT of GE during the day. Maybe get Humpty some exercise too. Or at least help him visit the new and exciting shelters located near elementary schools all across our fair County.

This was actually a project completed by one of our boy scouts here in GE. His intentions were nothing but good.

the issue as i see it is not one's appearance or socioeconomic standing, but respect for fellow human beings and public/private property. part of living in a city, town or village is investing in the well being of the community. unfortunately, people who only stay here for a night or two are unlikely to make that kind of commitment.

quote:

Originally posted by bitterboy:
... What do you do with a person who is filthy dirty and just downright smells offensive? These, as far as I know are not violations of our village ordinances, but does harm its economic development in a big way. I agree in that we shouldn't discriminate against a person based on their looks or social status. However, as unfortunate as it is, out of towners who come here to shop are not going to be as forgiving. I am not trying to be an *** here, but how do we handle this?

Could this be one reason shopping/stores have died off in the downtown area?

or the fact that most stores sell things that people don't want or need...

day six of the tour. two tours: sunday morning, 9/23. 8-9:00. sunday afternoon 2:30-2:45

two sightings on this bustling sunday morning in GE:
• young guy heading east on the pp at the taylor pedestrian bridge.
• mcsmokes sharing the ppp w the GE runners club folks.
Note: i saw what could be construed as two homeless guys at the train station. they had backpacks and were smoking (i know, it's very weak evidence). i approached and they nodded and smiled. i asked them when the next train arrived and they told me, correctly, it was 9:00. there were a few others waiting for the train w/ backpacks and i soon realized they were heading in for the bears game. so it seemed our fine town was unleashing early morning tail-gaters (read: drinkers) on chicago. thank god that scenario isn't the other way around. . .

zero sightings on sunday afternoon.

*please note: i checked the clark gas station memorial park for signs of the masses that clam saw the night before. two things to note, 1) only found a crushed soda can and a discarded plastic coke bottle. if there were 10 homeless there the night before they sure weren't very messy. for all i know the stuff was left by bratty GenYers -- and, man, we got plenty of them in town. 2) i did notice that the benches are partially hidden behind quite a bit of foliage, so the night before i MAY have missed seeing people that clam claims to have seen.

this is the last official town tour for me. i will continue to observe whenever i go to town, but i will not devote each day to verifying a GE CBD homeless problem. i feel that i have validated my original hypothesis that it's not that big of an issue. if you have to look as hard as i did, there is no overt problem/danger that requires ANOTHER ad hoc GE committee. yes, we have occasional homeless people in town (not a 24/7 issue) and they seem to be pretty harmless. in fact, after observing many homeless this past week, i can safely say that my neighbors and i are in MUCH more danger from the approx. 20-24 local adult drivers i observe speeding down my street every day, than the few homeless that roam the CBD a couple days a week.

as far as the homeless ruining business in the CBD, i have to say i believe that many years of the myriad short-sighted village boards, committees (traditional, ad hoc and otherwise) and property owners have done more (perhaps irreparable) damage to the CBD than the homeless. in fact, the arrival of the homeless are a simply a very real reaction to the many years of lack of foresight and planning.

Stinky McSmokes was present at Einstein's at 6:15 this morning, in his usual state of semi-consciousness. He did perk up for a moment to flick his butt onto the pavement. Nice.

He is a sad soul and I'm sure when he was 10 years old he didn't say he wanted to grow up to be what he is today. For me the biggest issues with him is the second hand smoke and poor hygiene, otherwise I'm live and let live. The smoking thing may take care of itself next year with the Illinois smoking ban, I think it states you can't be smoking within x amount of feet from a building entrance. If true that would mean McSmokes won't be able to loiter at Einstein's or in front of SBUX. That is, if the police enforce the law.

quote:

Originally posted by Clamato:

quote:

Originally posted by Fish:
You may not like these individuals that are so eloquently nick-named, but from what I am reading, the disdain seems to originate more from their mere existence in our presence than any "crime" they may be committing by asking for money or similar offenses. I dislike being asked for money from them exactly as much as I dislike being asked to buy peanuts from the Kiwanis at every other stop light. Despite my stinginess, the Kiwanis and our homeless persist in asking. Maybe they persist because it is profitable. (I've witnessed the exchange of "bills" (yes plural, but not sure of denomination) between a resident and a homeless person outside of Starbucks). I'm not saying that if the GE well ran dry for them that they would disappear, but I think it would help. Now, about those Kiwanis......

It really is one's prerogative to give money to whomever they wish, and I certainly don't fault those that wish to give their money to someone that they feel is deserving. My angle on this situation could very well apply to just about anyone, not necessarily the homeless. I do not dislike the homeless because they clutter our streets and make me feel guilty. They certainly do not do the latter. I dislike anyone that breaks the rules and laws of society that I myself would not be allowed to get away with. I am thoroughly disgusted by drunk/stoned gentlemen passed out on public benches. I am drunk with anger when I see vagrancy and panhandling. I am pissed beyond belief when I see a group of gentlemen, stripped down to their pants in a public park, drinking alcohol (again, could have been Perrier...I understand this) out of bottles wrapped in brown paper bags. Why does this anger me? Again, because I would not be allowed to do these things. I know I would not be allowed to do these things. Society and the law would not allow me to do these things. Yet there appears to be a subset of our population that is getting a pass with regard to the afforementioned behavior. Is it because they are homeless? I have no clue. Would I be equally as p1ssed if it were one of us exhibiting this behavior on the streets of our town? Hell yes.

Help the homeless all you like. And I say this to PADS and any other organization that feels they are helping those that are apparently in need. If you come into my home or my town, you damn well better treat it with the respect that you want to be treated yourself. Don't go p1ssing in our parks, don't go drinking on our streets, don't accost our citizens. You want to be a guest, be a good guest or stay the **** outta Dodge.

I read this response and felt you had a really strong reaction to my premise. The premise being that the complaining about our homeless and the "crimes" they commit is a pretext and what we really don't like is their revolting existence in our presence. They drink in public because they have no private place to drink. They p1ss in public because they have very limited access to bathrooms. The threat of arrest is little deterrent for these folks. Even if they were arrested for these activities, it would not keep them off our streets. No one gets locked up for these crimes.

Your reaction indicates to me that there is something about my premise that triggered you....tell me more.

quote:

Originally posted by t.a. superette:

*please note: i checked the clark gas station memorial park for signs of the masses that clam saw the night before. two things to note, 1) only found a crushed soda can and a discarded plastic coke bottle. if there were 10 homeless there the night before they sure weren't very messy. for all i know the stuff was left by bratty GenYers -- and, man, we got plenty of them in town. 2) i did notice that the benches are partially hidden behind quite a bit of foliage, so the night before i MAY have missed seeing people that clam claims to have seen.

I do appreciate my esteemed colleague's inference that I may either be fabricating the sighting of 10 men in Clark Station Memorial, or perhaps more gently, that I am mistaken. I can assure you, good sir, that neither is the case. When you and I drove by at 7:40, I agree that it was difficult to see. The way that park is set up, you have to look straight down the runway in order to see anyone on the benches. Nor did I say that there were 10 gents there that night. I just said that there were people there. Truth be told, the people sitting there that night could very well have been any family from Glen Ellyn enjoying the virtually unlit park...at night. But do not confuse this with what I witnessed in the afternoon. So amazed was I that I did not one, but two u-turns to see what was going on...much to the amazement and confusion of my 8 year-old son. There I witnessed approximately 8-10 me, half of whom were shirtless, and two of those were holding bottled swathed in paper bags...perhaps drinking San Pellegrino. I am many things, but I am seldom prone to fabrication or exaggeration...unless I can get a cheap laugh.

All that being said...I do agree with your theory that the CBD has been and will most likely continue to be irrelevant. And here is a shocker. I am not certain that I blame any one individual for its demise. Rather, you may be right that a locale completely off the beaten path and away from any major artery, a history of poor decision making on the part of past and even present administrations, and myriad competition...competition that continues to grow in every direction...seems to have sunk our little downtown area with the possible exception of service industries. We also live in a town where the majority of its inhabitants find it a major inconvenience to not have the ability to park directly in front of their destination. Restaurants can be our friends and there is no shame to have a million of them. I agree that Glen Ellyn could become a dining mecca in western suburbs...and that wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing. In hindsight, I rarely buy anything in town that cannot be consumed via the mouth...unless it is at the bike shop. Any improvement probably wouldn't have me changing my shopping pattern.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Clamato,

quote:

Originally posted by Fish:

quote:

Originally posted by Clamato:

quote:

Originally posted by Fish:
You may not like these individuals that are so eloquently nick-named, but from what I am reading, the disdain seems to originate more from their mere existence in our presence than any "crime" they may be committing by asking for money or similar offenses. I dislike being asked for money from them exactly as much as I dislike being asked to buy peanuts from the Kiwanis at every other stop light. Despite my stinginess, the Kiwanis and our homeless persist in asking. Maybe they persist because it is profitable. (I've witnessed the exchange of "bills" (yes plural, but not sure of denomination) between a resident and a homeless person outside of Starbucks). I'm not saying that if the GE well ran dry for them that they would disappear, but I think it would help. Now, about those Kiwanis......

It really is one's prerogative to give money to whomever they wish, and I certainly don't fault those that wish to give their money to someone that they feel is deserving. My angle on this situation could very well apply to just about anyone, not necessarily the homeless. I do not dislike the homeless because they clutter our streets and make me feel guilty. They certainly do not do the latter. I dislike anyone that breaks the rules and laws of society that I myself would not be allowed to get away with. I am thoroughly disgusted by drunk/stoned gentlemen passed out on public benches. I am drunk with anger when I see vagrancy and panhandling. I am pissed beyond belief when I see a group of gentlemen, stripped down to their pants in a public park, drinking alcohol (again, could have been Perrier...I understand this) out of bottles wrapped in brown paper bags. Why does this anger me? Again, because I would not be allowed to do these things. I know I would not be allowed to do these things. Society and the law would not allow me to do these things. Yet there appears to be a subset of our population that is getting a pass with regard to the afforementioned behavior. Is it because they are homeless? I have no clue. Would I be equally as p1ssed if it were one of us exhibiting this behavior on the streets of our town? Hell yes.

Help the homeless all you like. And I say this to PADS and any other organization that feels they are helping those that are apparently in need. If you come into my home or my town, you damn well better treat it with the respect that you want to be treated yourself. Don't go p1ssing in our parks, don't go drinking on our streets, don't accost our citizens. You want to be a guest, be a good guest or stay the **** outta Dodge.

I read this response and felt you had a really strong reaction to my premise. The premise being that the complaining about our homeless and the "crimes" they commit is a pretext and what we really don't like is their revolting existence in our presence. They drink in public because they have no private place to drink. They p1ss in public because they have very limited access to bathrooms. The threat of arrest is little deterrent for these folks. Even if they were arrested for these activities, it would not keep them off our streets. No one gets locked up for these crimes.

Your reaction indicates to me that there is something about my premise that triggered you....tell me more.

I am 100% uncertain why I used your post in mine. It may have simply been an error on my part. Please accept my apologies for any confusion that may have caused.

have to side with clam here...it's the laws and following them AND enforcing them that matter. let's see what would happen if clam or i decide to walk down main street with a paper bag bourban street style! last summer some kids (18-19) were busted at night on their way home for partying at Newton...how is it that the teens/early 20's get busted ALL THE TIME, both here and in wheaton, but ALL KINDS of anti-social (and illegal, i might add...panhandling, drinking in public, etc) is allowed downtown...i've heard of instances where the police actually enter backyards... here's a cynical angle...could it be that ticketing teens/early 20's who generally have income (either their own, or their parents) is more lucritive to the village coffers than ticketing the homeless? I'm all for enforcing laws about underage drinking. now let's enforce ALL the laws, for ALL the people, homeless or not.

As I've stated before-Follow the money.

quote:

Originally posted by howdy60137:
have to side with clam here...it's the laws and following them AND enforcing them that matter. ..... I'm all for enforcing laws about underage drinking. now let's enforce ALL the laws, for ALL the people, homeless or not.

I really think it would accomplish little and not effect any permanent change. The "crimes" are not serious and even if we arrest them and even if the prosecutor decides to prosecute, what punishment is a judge going to hand down that would be any more severe than what they deal with on a daily basis? They are NOT going to be locked up.

Reading through all this, I'm reminded of something. In the late '90's, I worked at a hedge fund located in Beverly Hills. The "alternative" financial community in Beverly Hills is all located on or in the near vacinity of Rodeo Drive (Roxbury also, that's where Drexel's old offices were), so when it came time for lunch, we would all take a stroll up Rodeo to Baja Fresh or Jamba Juice (before these chains made their way to the midwest) and I was shocked to see homeless/bums/winos (whatever one prefers to call them) openly intoxicated and passed out on the public sidewalks and in many instances propped up against some of the most prestigious and hoitey-toidey stores in the world! You could literally walk past Armani and have the door man (most of the stores have door-men there) stand outside as a bum lay beside him! Later I found out that the highly liberal enclave of Beverly Hills and Santa Monica actually have an ordinance where you cannot ask the homeless to relocate regardless of their condition/disposition. I found that to be unbelievable! The other interesting observation I had was that the "locals" didn't even notice them; might as well didn't even exist, however, the Asian tourists were appalled. Only in America, folks. At any rate, GE is a far cry from Beverly Hills, but perhaps some of the same attitude, at least on the part of the local legislature exists. Another ironic thing is that while Beverly Hills police would basically treat the homeless as invisible, they wouldn't hesitate to write a jay-walking pedestrian a $75 ticket if you stepped off the curb when you didn't have the right-of-way light. Then again, I guess a jay-walker is breaking the law, while a bum really isn't.